Could you just stop updating over and over the same articles, especially *just a few days before* a new Firefox release? I mean, articles like How do I tell if my connection to a website is secure? are perfectly readable just as they are *now*. Unless there are serious errors in the text I beg you to please do not trigger other edit requests for the same articles and differ the review approval *after* the next release of Firefox.
I am available to talk about this if you want.
Thanks for your attention.
Hello,
Could you just stop updating over and over the same articles, especially *just a few days before* a new Firefox release? I mean, articles like [[How do I tell if my connection to a website is secure?]] are perfectly readable just as they are *now*. Unless there are serious errors in the text I beg you to please do not trigger other edit requests for the same articles and differ the review approval *after* the next release of Firefox.
I am available to talk about this if you want.
Thanks for your attention.
Apologies for the noise in the KB channels. We usually want to have everything ready before the release, and sometimes there's a bit of cosmetic changes needed, but I understand your frustration with receiving notifications about changes in the source content.
We'll look into using a "minor edit" feature more frequently for articles that require touching up, but without significant changes.
Cheers,
Michał
Hi Simone,
Apologies for the noise in the KB channels. We usually want to have everything ready before the release, and sometimes there's a bit of cosmetic changes needed, but I understand your frustration with receiving notifications about changes in the source content.
We'll look into using a "minor edit" feature more frequently for articles that require touching up, but without significant changes.
Cheers,
Michał
I'm sorry for the last-minute changes. That article needed a correction (it mentions a grey lock that no longer exists), so I took the opportunity to make other (minor) changes as well.
I should have treated those two as separate revisions so only one with show up in your dashboard. I'll do that going forward.
Joni
Hi Simone,
I'm sorry for the last-minute changes. That article needed a correction (it mentions a grey lock that no longer exists), so I took the opportunity to make other (minor) changes as well.
I should have treated those two as separate revisions so only one with show up in your dashboard. I'll do that going forward.
Joni
The problem is that it is very difficult to deal with this amount of changes just a few days before a release. We have 6 weeks to change articles: why concentrate the localizers' work only in the last week?
The problem is that it is very difficult to deal with this amount of changes just a few days before a release. We have 6 weeks to change articles: why concentrate the localizers' work only in the last week?
I understand the problem and I agree that it's frustrating. We had most of the articles ready for localization a couple of weeks before the release. While we would also like to have them ready a month prior, that's proved impossible because of because of a number of factors beyond our control (last-minute bugs, UI changes, and even campaign messaging). Having a release that's tied to a campaign is especially difficult because we have to work with other teams (Legal and PR) on approved messaging, and they're not always ready to work with our timeline. There were even some articles I had prepared a month ago that ended up being outdated a few days before a release.
Part of the surge in edits might have also been attributed to SUMO KB day. While it's great to see contributors enthusiastically editing articles, perhaps we should avoid doing this the week before a release. I'll take note of this for the future.
Thanks for being patient with us. We'll work to make things go more smoothly.
Joni
I understand the problem and I agree that it's frustrating. We had most of the articles ready for localization a couple of weeks before the release. While we would also like to have them ready a month prior, that's proved impossible because of because of a number of factors beyond our control (last-minute bugs, UI changes, and even campaign messaging). Having a release that's tied to a campaign is especially difficult because we have to work with other teams (Legal and PR) on approved messaging, and they're not always ready to work with our timeline. There were even some articles I had prepared a month ago that ended up being outdated a few days before a release.
Part of the surge in edits might have also been attributed to SUMO KB day. While it's great to see contributors enthusiastically editing articles, perhaps we should avoid doing this the week before a release. I'll take note of this for the future.
Thanks for being patient with us. We'll work to make things go more smoothly.
Joni
I just want to say that it's also hard for a localizer to check an article *after* it has been marked as ready for localization.
I try to approve changes as soon as possible, but I've seen this approach often makes me work A LOT more than needed. Maybe it's better to wait a couple of days until changes "settle down" - so to speak.
The same thing is happening with article [[Password Manager - Remember, delete, change and import saved passwords in Firefox]].
I just want to say that it's also hard for a localizer to check an article *after* it has been marked as ready for localization.
I try to approve changes as soon as possible, but I've seen this approach often makes me work A LOT more than needed. Maybe it's better to wait a couple of days until changes "settle down" - so to speak.
That article was marked ready to localize multiple times since January 15th. Much work and lots of discussion was involved, trying to get it right (more changes are pending review). See this thread for the background.
''Underpass [[#post-67940|said]]''
<blockquote>
The same thing is happening with article [[Password Manager - Remember, delete, change and import saved passwords in Firefox]].
</blockquote>
That article was marked ready to localize multiple times since January 15th. Much work and lots of discussion was involved, trying to get it right (more changes are pending review). See [https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/password-manager-remember-delete-change-and-import/discuss/6338 this thread] for the background.
Hello, the problem for me is not that an article is worked and reworked - I think this is perfectly normal.
The problem is that it shouldn't be marked as ready multiple times, and - above all - not in the very last week before a new Firefox release, IMHO.
It's very difficult to track the changes between two localization revisions *not yet approved*. Sometimes is even more convenient to trash the first revision and start from scratch. But this also means a lot of work (and overhead).
Hello, the problem for me is not that an article is worked and reworked - I think this is perfectly normal.
The problem is that it shouldn't be marked as ready multiple times, and - above all - not in the very last week before a new Firefox release, IMHO.
It's very difficult to track the changes between two localization revisions *not yet approved*. Sometimes is even more convenient to trash the first revision and start from scratch. But this also means a lot of work (and overhead).
I know it is said "Rules are made to be broken" but we do have guidelines that specify "only mark top articles as ready for localization four weeks before a release" I suspect that rule is now broken countless times.
Maybe we need serious rethinks on how we write some articles. We no doubt come under pressure from other parts of Sumo but why can we not explain our rule and the reasons for it and stick to it a lot more frequently.
If a marketing department or whoever needs us to make an exception maybe we should ask them to loan us the extra staff or volunteers to enable us to speedily complete all the additional related work.
Cross Link
I have whinged about this previously including in this L10n forum
===Top article "freeze"===
Localization is a lot of work and is often done by just one person. Only the top 20 or so articles get localized in some locales. Our top articles generally don't need any changes other than updates for a new version of Firefox. Since we know what's coming, we try to make sure that all required changes are done four weeks prior to a Firefox release so that localizers can use those four weeks for getting their work done.
Therefore, we should only mark top articles as ready for localization four weeks before a release. All updates for the next six weeks should NOT be marked ready for localization. Of course if there is a change that is critical and should be translated, we'll have to make an exception.
I know it is said "Rules are made to be broken" but we do have guidelines that specify "'''''only mark top articles as ready for localization four weeks before a release'''''" I suspect that rule is now broken countless times.
Maybe we need serious rethinks on how we write some articles. We no doubt come under pressure from other parts of Sumo but why can we not explain our rule and the reasons for it and stick to it a lot more frequently.
If a marketing department or whoever needs us to make an exception maybe we should ask them to loan us the extra staff or volunteers to enable us to speedily complete all the additional related work.
-----------
Cross Link
I have whinged about this previously including in this L10n forum
* [/forums/l10n-forum/711443#post-66361 Is it a new policy to treat many locales differently to en-US] ''John99 said''
<blockquote> ....
I wonder how many of us remember the guidelines on article freezes. Our guidelines are to try to give localisers 4 weeks notice of changes
* [[Article review guidelines#w_top-article-freeze|Article review guidelines_top-article-freeze]]
<blockquote>===Top article "freeze"===
Localization is a lot of work and is often done by just one person. Only the top 20 or so articles get localized in some locales. Our top articles generally don't need any changes other than updates for a new version of Firefox. Since we know what's coming, we try to make sure that all required changes are done four weeks prior to a Firefox release so that localizers can use those four weeks for getting their work done.
'''Therefore, we should only mark top articles as ready for localization four weeks before a release. All updates for the next six weeks should NOT be marked ready for localization.''' Of course if there is a change that is critical and should be translated, we'll have to make an exception.</blockquote>
</blockquote>
This is something I’d like to see more input from localizers on. On IRC, I was asked by a localizer to mark more edits as ready for localization. It seems that each localizer has his/her preference about when to mark an edit as ready for localization, so if we can get more localizers coming in, it will help establish a consensus.
For those interested, a related discussion is going on in the KB articles forum, in a thread posted May 6, 2016 at 6:28:43 PM EDT by Kim Ludvigsen:
https://support.mozilla.org/forums/knowledge-base-articles/711969 Quality of the articles and proof reading
''Chris Ilias said'' (on May 7, 2016):
<blockquote>
This is something I’d like to see more input from localizers on. On IRC, I was asked by a localizer to mark more edits as ready for localization. It seems that each localizer has his/her preference about when to mark an edit as ready for localization, so if we can get more localizers coming in, it will help establish a consensus.
