X
Tap here to go to the mobile version of the site.

Support Forum

"Not Responding" Error

Posted

People, is there now or will there ever be a fix for the "not responding" problem? I know that "conventional wisdom" says this isn't a Thunderbird problem, it's an anti-virus problem. But I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this. I've seen reports from people using three or four different anti-virus programs. Do they all have the same bug in them that blows up Thunderbird? Hard to believe. And why don't other email clients hang up when virus scanners are present? And since I'm using Norton and not MSE, telling me to use another anti-virus other than MSE and marking the problem "SOLVED" isn't any help.

I used to have the problem occasionally when I was running Thunderbird on Vista and Win7. Now that I'm on Win10, it literally happens every half hour or so. Thunderbird on Vista and Win7 would recover fairly quickly. Thunderbird on Win10 takes several minutes.

I like Thunderbird, I have Thunderbird set up the way I like, I'm used to Thunderbird. And in comparisons with other email clients, it appears that everyone else likes Thunderbird, too. But it's gotten to the point with me that Thunderbird is (almost) totally useless.

People, is there now or will there ever be a fix for the "not responding" problem? I know that "conventional wisdom" says this isn't a Thunderbird problem, it's an anti-virus problem. But I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this. I've seen reports from people using three or four different anti-virus programs. Do they all have the same bug in them that blows up Thunderbird? Hard to believe. And why don't other email clients hang up when virus scanners are present? And since I'm using Norton and not MSE, telling me to use another anti-virus other than MSE and marking the problem "SOLVED" isn't any help. I used to have the problem occasionally when I was running Thunderbird on Vista and Win7. Now that I'm on Win10, it literally happens every half hour or so. Thunderbird on Vista and Win7 would recover fairly quickly. Thunderbird on Win10 takes several minutes. I like Thunderbird, I have Thunderbird set up the way I like, I'm used to Thunderbird. And in comparisons with other email clients, it appears that everyone else likes Thunderbird, too. But it's gotten to the point with me that Thunderbird is (almost) totally useless.

Chosen solution

> Look, you tell me to get over myself.

that was me. It must be time for me to leave

Read this answer in context 0

Additional System Details

Installed Plug-ins

  • ActiveTouch General Plugin Container Version 105
  • Adobe PDF Plug-In For Firefox and Netscape 15.10.20056
  • Citrix Online App Detector Plugin
  • Coupons, Inc. Coupon Printer 5.0.2.8
  • NPRuntime Script Plug-in Library for Java(TM) Deploy
  • Next Generation Java Plug-in 11.73.2 for Mozilla browsers
  • The plugin allows you to have a better experience with Microsoft SharePoint
  • NPWLPG
  • A component of your photo software powered by RocketLife
  • Shockwave Flash 21.0 r0
  • 5.1.41212.0
  • VLC media player Web Plugin
  • WildTangent Games App V2 Presence Detector

Application

  • User Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/45.0

More Information

Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

Well my personal opinion of Norton is that it is a disaster in a box, only to be installed if you want trouble.

My issues with Norton are.

  1. It deletes entire folders of mail automatically if it finds a virus. Regardless of the fact that the virus is inert and can not possibly infect anything while stored in mail.
  2. It block each new version of Thunderbird as unknown software, even 9.9.1 security releases requiring the user to manually update the firewall component or wait a few days till it get a message from home.
  3. Turning off email scanning sometime does not really. The only way to test without it is the operating system safe mode with Networking.
  4. It can not scan mail on SSL or TLS secured connections. Nor can it scan mail in IMAP mail accounts. So it's mail scanning capability is really Zero these days as there are basically no mail providers that only offer POP without connection security.

Norton has an integrated component in Outlook that scans mail, so it leaves PST files alone. Not so Thunderbird. It scans mail store files aggressively. Given it takes it some 10 minutes per GB to scan, your files are locked for scanning a lot of the time. "Not responding" is to be expected if the data files are locked by an external program. So we recommend you create an eception for the mail and IMAP mail folders in your profile at minimum as well the the root of your profile folder.

See here for Norton instructions https://support.symantec.com/en_US/article.HOWTO80920.html

A year ago you posted a very similar question.Back then you insisted it was not an anti virus problem.

I explained it to you then. So is it you don't believe me, or your not capable of comprehending the relevant facts.

Lets put this to bed once and for all. Anti virus used to scan executable files and documents (mostly MS office) that had auto execute macros. Now they scan every file other than an arbitrarily created list. such a PST files.

Thunderbird maintains large database files. One per folder and one for the global index. These files only grow unless you compact folders. Have a look at your profile, how large is it? Now using 10 minutes per GB how long qwill it take to scan?

In answer to your question. Yes all the anti virus programs contain the same brain dead logic that blows up Thunderbird. They all try and scan it's data files while it is trying to use them. That has not changed in the last year.

Well my personal opinion of Norton is that it is a disaster in a box, only to be installed if you want trouble. My issues with Norton are. #It deletes entire folders of mail automatically if it finds a virus. Regardless of the fact that the virus is inert and can not possibly infect anything while stored in mail. #It block each new version of Thunderbird as unknown software, even 9.9.1 security releases requiring the user to manually update the firewall component or wait a few days till it get a message from home. #Turning off email scanning sometime does not really. The only way to test without it is the operating system safe mode with Networking. #It can not scan mail on SSL or TLS secured connections. Nor can it scan mail in IMAP mail accounts. So it's mail scanning capability is really Zero these days as there are basically no mail providers that only offer POP without connection security. Norton has an integrated component in Outlook that scans mail, so it leaves PST files alone. Not so Thunderbird. It scans mail store files aggressively. Given it takes it some 10 minutes per GB to scan, your files are locked for scanning a lot of the time. "Not responding" is to be expected if the data files are locked by an external program. So we recommend you create an eception for the mail and IMAP mail folders in your profile at minimum as well the the root of your profile folder. See here for Norton instructions https://support.symantec.com/en_US/article.HOWTO80920.html A year ago you posted a very similar question.Back then you insisted it was not an anti virus problem. I explained it to you then. So is it you don't believe me, or your not capable of comprehending the relevant facts. Lets put this to bed once and for all. Anti virus used to scan executable files and documents (mostly MS office) that had auto execute macros. Now they scan every file other than an arbitrarily created list. such a PST files. Thunderbird maintains large database files. One per folder and one for the global index. These files only grow unless you compact folders. Have a look at your profile, how large is it? Now using 10 minutes per GB how long qwill it take to scan? In answer to your question. Yes all the anti virus programs contain the same brain dead logic that blows up Thunderbird. They all try and scan it's data files while it is trying to use them. That has not changed in the last year.
Wayne Mery
  • Top 25 Contributor
  • Moderator
582 solutions 5463 answers

So you've gone through https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Memory_Usage_Problems and not one of the items has proved useful?

So you've gone through https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Memory_Usage_Problems and not one of the items has proved useful?

Question owner

Is it supposed to be intuitively obvious that the "not responding" issue is a memory usage problem? Because it isn't to me. I can see nothing from the symptoms that would lead me to believe this problem is a memory problem. So no, I haven't gone through through that information. If the fix Matt suggested, excluding the mail files from Norton's search, doesn't work, I'll look at these suggestions.

Is it supposed to be intuitively obvious that the "not responding" issue is a memory usage problem? Because it isn't to me. I can see nothing from the symptoms that would lead me to believe this problem is a memory problem. So no, I haven't gone through through that information. If the fix Matt suggested, excluding the mail files from Norton's search, doesn't work, I'll look at these suggestions.

Question owner

Last year when you responded to my similar question, all I recall you doing was going off on a rant about the evils of anti-virus software. You offered no explanation that time about why the AV software might be causing the problem as you did this time, and you certainly didn't offer any suggestions for a fix as you did this time. Your only "solution" was to completely uninstall my AV protection. I don't know how you protect your systems against viruses and malware but Norton has saved my butt several times, and there's no way I'm going to totally uninstall it.

So yes, you could say I didn't believe you. You gave me no good reason to believe you. I've followed the advice and instructions you gave me this time, which you could have done last time, and we'll see how it works.

Last year when you responded to my similar question, all I recall you doing was going off on a rant about the evils of anti-virus software. You offered no explanation that time about why the AV software might be causing the problem as you did this time, and you certainly didn't offer any suggestions for a fix as you did this time. Your only "solution" was to completely uninstall my AV protection. I don't know how you protect your systems against viruses and malware but Norton has saved my butt several times, and there's no way I'm going to totally uninstall it. So yes, you could say I didn't believe you. You gave me no good reason to believe you. I've followed the advice and instructions you gave me this time, which you could have done last time, and we'll see how it works.
Wayne Mery
  • Top 25 Contributor
  • Moderator
582 solutions 5463 answers

If you took a mere second to look at the stats next our names you'd see we're not joe citizen fresh off the street. Matt and I (and many of the volunteers here) have spent years working with the software in various capacities and are well qualified to offer advice. It's time to get over yourself and stop wasting our time with all your doubts.

Here's plenty of ammunitition about AV https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Antivirus_Related_Performance_Issues

If you bothered to look at the first few sentences of https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Memory_Usage_Problems you'd see it's about way more than just about memory.

If you took a mere second to look at the stats next our names you'd see we're not joe citizen fresh off the street. Matt and I (and many of the volunteers here) have spent years working with the software in various capacities and are well qualified to offer advice. It's time to get over yourself and stop wasting our time with all your doubts. Here's plenty of ammunitition about AV https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Antivirus_Related_Performance_Issues If you bothered to look at the first few sentences of https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Memory_Usage_Problems you'd see it's about way more than just about memory.

Question owner

And you totally missed my point. It doesn't matter what information is available about a problem and how much combined time and knowledge you have if you don't make that knowledge easily available. I say again, how am I supposed to know about all these wonderful support articles if they aren't readily pointed out to the user? How am I supposed to know that https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:* has all this information? It didn't show up on any of the Forum pages I looked at.

It's time for you to get over _your self_ and stop wasting my time telling me what a jerk I am.

And by the way, Matt's advice about excluding the mailboxes in Norton scans didn't solve the problem.

And you totally missed my point. It doesn't matter what information is available about a problem and how much combined time and knowledge you have if you don't make that knowledge easily available. I say again, how am I supposed to know about all these wonderful support articles if they aren't readily pointed out to the user? How am I supposed to know that https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:* has all this information? It didn't show up on any of the Forum pages I looked at. It's time for you to get over _your self_ and stop wasting my time telling me what a jerk I am. And by the way, Matt's advice about excluding the mailboxes in Norton scans didn't solve the problem.

Question owner

A few weeks ago, I had a complete HD failure, I had to replace the drive and rebuild my system. I downloaded and installed a fresh copy of Thunderbird and noticed it wasn't the same version as the one on the crashed disk. I downloaded and installed Norton, which I noticed was exactly the same version as the one on the crashed disk. I rebuilt an identical profile as on my old Thunderbird, not hard to do since I use Thunderbird to manage several gmail accounts. So my mail files were of (nearly) identical size.

For months before the crash, Thunderbird would hang with the "not responding" message several times a day. Since the re-build, it hasn't hung once,

Just sayin'...

A few weeks ago, I had a complete HD failure, I had to replace the drive and rebuild my system. I downloaded and installed a fresh copy of Thunderbird and noticed it wasn't the same version as the one on the crashed disk. I downloaded and installed Norton, which I noticed was exactly the same version as the one on the crashed disk. I rebuilt an identical profile as on my old Thunderbird, not hard to do since I use Thunderbird to manage several gmail accounts. So my mail files were of (nearly) identical size. For months before the crash, Thunderbird would hang with the "not responding" message several times a day. Since the re-build, it hasn't hung once, Just sayin'...
Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

What are you just saying? Your hard disk was faulty and causing issues for ages before it finally gave up the ghost? That is what I read here.. Just saying.

What are you just saying? Your hard disk was faulty and causing issues for ages before it finally gave up the ghost? That is what I read here.. Just saying.

Question owner

Gee, Matt I'm sorry you appear to have a problem with reading comprehension. I don't see a single thing I said in my last post that implies I was having drive issues "for ages". What I was "just sayin'" was that only one variable in the equation changed, and that was a new version of Thunderbird. Just to be direct about it so you'll have no excuse for misinterpreting, I did not experience any issues with my system or any other application before the disk crash. Are you "just sayin'" that an impending disk failure is going to be application specific?

Look, you tell me to get over myself. Why don't you attempt to do the same? Look over the history of this issue in these forums. Many people have experienced the same problem and many of them have tried your suggestions and many of them report that the issue still exists. Can you honestly tell me you've thoroughly examined your architecture and your code and there's no possible way it could be a Thunderbird problem? Not even a possibility? Ever hear of the McCabe Complexity Theory? How many lines of code are in the TBird source? Most people I've worked with in a 45 year career in high tech subscribe to the idea that every piece of significant software has bugs in it, and if a piece of software doesn't have bugs in it, it isn't significant.

Matt, I'm NOT telling you your baby is ugly. Thunderbird is overall a great piece of software, and the fact that it's freeware really boggles my mind. I will say again that the way you and your buddy there behave on this forum would never, never, be tolerated in a for-profit organization. Yes, I'm testy about this. I'm testy about it because I've seen a lot of very unprofessional behavior from you guys and not a lot of openness to anything that doesn't jibe with your closely held opinions.

Gee, Matt I'm sorry you appear to have a problem with reading comprehension. I don't see a single thing I said in my last post that implies I was having drive issues "for ages". What I was "just sayin'" was that only one variable in the equation changed, and that was a new version of Thunderbird. Just to be direct about it so you'll have no excuse for misinterpreting, I did not experience any issues with my system or any other application before the disk crash. Are you "just sayin'" that an impending disk failure is going to be application specific? Look, you tell me to get over myself. Why don't you attempt to do the same? Look over the history of this issue in these forums. Many people have experienced the same problem and many of them have tried your suggestions and many of them report that the issue still exists. Can you honestly tell me you've thoroughly examined your architecture and your code and there's no possible way it could be a Thunderbird problem? Not even a possibility? Ever hear of the McCabe Complexity Theory? How many lines of code are in the TBird source? Most people I've worked with in a 45 year career in high tech subscribe to the idea that every piece of significant software has bugs in it, and if a piece of software doesn't have bugs in it, it isn't significant. Matt, I'm NOT telling you your baby is ugly. Thunderbird is overall a great piece of software, and the fact that it's freeware really boggles my mind. I will say again that the way you and your buddy there behave on this forum would never, never, be tolerated in a for-profit organization. Yes, I'm testy about this. I'm testy about it because I've seen a lot of very unprofessional behavior from you guys and not a lot of openness to anything that doesn't jibe with your closely held opinions.
Wayne Mery
  • Top 25 Contributor
  • Moderator
582 solutions 5463 answers

Chosen Solution

> Look, you tell me to get over myself.

that was me. It must be time for me to leave

> Look, you tell me to get over myself. that was me. It must be time for me to leave

Question owner

I'm going out the other door...

I'm going out the other door...
Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

Cartaphilus08 said

I'm going out the other door...

Good idea. because I see two variable. A hard disk and a software version change. My money is on the hardware. You think differently. You are entitled to.

But please prove me wrong. if there is an issue in Thunderbird (there are many) that you can identify explicitly. Please file a bug. Give the developers sets to reproduce the issue. If they can not reproduce it they can not fix it.

''Cartaphilus08 [[#answer-866019|said]]'' <blockquote> I'm going out the other door... </blockquote> Good idea. because I see two variable. A hard disk and a software version change. My money is on the hardware. You think differently. You are entitled to. But please prove me wrong. if there is an issue in Thunderbird (there are many) that you can identify explicitly. Please file a bug. Give the developers sets to reproduce the issue. If they can not reproduce it they can not fix it.
aardvark2zz 0 solutions 7 answers

For many versions of Thunderbird over the years I get Thunderbird not-responding 40% of the time for over 2 minutes!!! Even for several individual emails. Have had latest versions of Thunderbird. I now want Thunderbird ESR but apparently it's not available. Do you have a debug version cause I'm getting fed up.

Especially happens when I do cntl-s to save email or even when I switch between composed emails.

There is no CPU used by Thunderbird, no Hard drive usage, no wifi bandwidth, no growth in RAM usage, etc.... during not-responding. No other softwares nor hardware affected.

I got so fed up that I've disabled all addons and plug-ins except for english and french dictionary and flash.

Latest Thunderbird, Win 8, Win 8.1, Anti-virus off, 8-logical core intel. Always latest updates. 16GB RAM. Thunderbird used 200MB.

Is there a way to disable the calendar it was giving me problems when it 1st came out.

For many versions of Thunderbird over the years I get Thunderbird not-responding 40% of the time for over 2 minutes!!! Even for several individual emails. Have had latest versions of Thunderbird. I now want Thunderbird ESR but apparently it's not available. Do you have a debug version cause I'm getting fed up. Especially happens when I do cntl-s to save email or even when I switch between composed emails. There is no CPU used by Thunderbird, no Hard drive usage, no wifi bandwidth, no growth in RAM usage, etc.... during not-responding. No other softwares nor hardware affected. I got so fed up that I've disabled all addons and plug-ins except for english and french dictionary and flash. Latest Thunderbird, Win 8, Win 8.1, Anti-virus off, 8-logical core intel. Always latest updates. 16GB RAM. Thunderbird used 200MB. Is there a way to disable the calendar it was giving me problems when it 1st came out.

Modified by aardvark2zz

Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

Why you would want flash in Thunderbird defeats me. do you make extensive use of RSS feeds? That is just a security issue waiting to happen.

To diagnose problems with Thunderbird, try the following:

  • Restart Thunderbird with add-ons disabled (Thunderbird Safe Mode). On the Help menu, click on "Restart with Add-ons Disabled". If Thunderbird works like normal, there is an Add-on or Theme interfering with normal operations. You will need to re-enable add-ons one at a time until you locate the offender.

Then I suggest you look here https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Memory_Usage_Problems#Diagnosis_Steps

Otherwise I suggest you ask your own question.

Why you would want flash in Thunderbird defeats me. do you make extensive use of RSS feeds? That is just a security issue waiting to happen. To diagnose problems with Thunderbird, try the following: *Restart Thunderbird with add-ons disabled (Thunderbird Safe Mode). On the Help menu, click on "Restart with Add-ons Disabled". If Thunderbird works like normal, there is an Add-on or Theme interfering with normal operations. You will need to re-enable add-ons one at a time until you locate the offender. Then I suggest you look here https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Memory_Usage_Problems#Diagnosis_Steps Otherwise I suggest you ask your own question.
aisling13 0 solutions 5 answers

I have been having this problem now ever since I installed Thunderbird - and I have been a user along time, many years. Currently on the latest version of TB and up to date Windows 10 and currently Avast anti virus. Nothing seems to make the problem go away - love TB, hate 'not responding'.

Any latest help?

I have been having this problem now ever since I installed Thunderbird - and I have been a user along time, many years. Currently on the latest version of TB and up to date Windows 10 and currently Avast anti virus. Nothing seems to make the problem go away - love TB, hate 'not responding'. Any latest help?
Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

Helpful Reply

aisling13 said

I have been having this problem now ever since I installed Thunderbird - and I have been a user along time, many years. Currently on the latest version of TB and up to date Windows 10 and currently Avast anti virus. Nothing seems to make the problem go away - love TB, hate 'not responding'. Any latest help?

As your last question has languished I will address some of this here. But please post a new topic. I am not sure those others on this thread really want to hear your sorry unfold in their inboxes. Post a link here for the new question and I will try and follow along, as will Wayne I think.

just a whole heap of questions...

If you disable windows search indexing service in Windows do things improve? Right click your account in the folder pane and select settings. In server settings for the account there is an entry for "Local Directory"... What is in that field. I would expect something similar to

C:\Users\Mat\AppData\Roaming\Thunderbird\Profiles\eq45osx2.default\ImapMail\imap.gmail.com

Have you read the known issues with AVAST and slowness.... slowness and not responding are almost the same thing. See https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Antivirus_Related_Performance_Issues#AVAST Right click

''aisling13 [[#answer-912649|said]]'' <blockquote> I have been having this problem now ever since I installed Thunderbird - and I have been a user along time, many years. Currently on the latest version of TB and up to date Windows 10 and currently Avast anti virus. Nothing seems to make the problem go away - love TB, hate 'not responding'. Any latest help? </blockquote> As your last question has languished I will address some of this here. But please post a new topic. I am not sure those others on this thread really want to hear your sorry unfold in their inboxes. Post a link here for the new question and I will try and follow along, as will Wayne I think. just a whole heap of questions... If you disable windows search indexing service in Windows do things improve? Right click your account in the folder pane and select settings. In server settings for the account there is an entry for "Local Directory"... What is in that field. I would expect something similar to C:\Users\Mat\AppData\Roaming\Thunderbird\Profiles\eq45osx2.default\ImapMail\imap.gmail.com Have you read the known issues with AVAST and slowness.... slowness and not responding are almost the same thing. See https://wiki.mozilla.org/Thunderbird:Testing:Antivirus_Related_Performance_Issues#AVAST Right click
aisling13 0 solutions 5 answers

SUCCESS I think. I disabled the Windows Search Indexing and the 'not responding' problem has gone away - 2 days without an occurrence. Enabled it again and 'not responding' appeared again but not as frequently as before. So it does not look like an Avast issue in this case. Thanks very much Matt for your helpful suggestions.

SUCCESS I think. I disabled the Windows Search Indexing and the 'not responding' problem has gone away - 2 days without an occurrence. Enabled it again and 'not responding' appeared again but not as frequently as before. So it does not look like an Avast issue in this case. Thanks very much Matt for your helpful suggestions.
Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

Helpful Reply

Can we continue this a bit. Understanding what impact with Windows 10 has been long coming.

What is the path to your Thunderbird profile? There is a show button in the troubleshooting information on the help menu that will open the folder for you. Is it included in what windows search is supposed to be indexing?

Can we continue this a bit. Understanding what impact with Windows 10 has been long coming. What is the path to your Thunderbird profile? There is a show button in the troubleshooting information on the help menu that will open the folder for you. Is it included in what windows search is supposed to be indexing?
aisling13 0 solutions 5 answers

The TB profile is

C:\Users\rob\AppData\Roaming\Thunderbird\Profiles\ba7g9usb.default

and Users is included in the Search locations ( though AppData appears to be specifically excluded - the string AppData; AppData is in the excluded column)

The TB profile is C:\Users\rob\AppData\Roaming\Thunderbird\Profiles\ba7g9usb.default and Users is included in the Search locations ( though AppData appears to be specifically excluded - the string AppData; AppData is in the excluded column)
Matt
  • Top 10 Contributor
  • Moderator
3252 solutions 22416 answers

where does that mail entry point to? I ask, because mine has no mail entry.

While I can understand that the indexing service might strain the ability of a slow machine. I would not expect it to be an issue as it obviously appears to be. (I have issues with slowness, but it appears to be windows 10 wide, not limited to Thunderbird or firefox.)

where does that mail entry point to? I ask, because mine has no mail entry. While I can understand that the indexing service might strain the ability of a slow machine. I would not expect it to be an issue as it obviously appears to be. (I have issues with slowness, but it appears to be windows 10 wide, not limited to Thunderbird or firefox.)