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Dúnadh an snáithe seo agus cuireadh sa chartlann é. Cuir ceist nua má tá cabhair uait.

How do I get my tabs back below the bookmark toolbar? And why the hell did you change this??? And now white on black? Unreadable.

  • 55 freagra
  • 127 leis an bhfadhb seo
  • 159 views
  • Freagra is déanaí ó fedup101

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You really need to employ some graphic artists. This is the worst change I have seen in Firefox. The tabs should be BELOW the bookmark toolbar, right above the pages. That's where your eye most easily rests when you're looking for a tab. I looked at "solutions" but I'm not a freaking software engineer!! I just need to get the tabs back down where they were and can't find a solution. If I can't find one I guess I'll have to go back to Safari, which I don't like as well as I have liked Firefox all these years, but this change is just too much.

Also, it's not bad enough to put the tabs at the top (where your eye does not easily travel to!), but now the tabs are white type on a black background. Perhaps fine for 25-year-old eyes, but not for older eyes or visually challenged people in general. And if you have multiple tabs open, which many multitaskers do, you can only see a few letters. I could go on and on about how horrible this new change is, but please take some advice from a retired graphic designer. Black backgrounds with faint light type are not the way to go.

You really need to employ some graphic artists. This is the worst change I have seen in Firefox. The tabs should be BELOW the bookmark toolbar, right above the pages. That's where your eye most easily rests when you're looking for a tab. I looked at "solutions" but I'm not a freaking software engineer!! I just need to get the tabs back down where they were and can't find a solution. If I can't find one I guess I'll have to go back to Safari, which I don't like as well as I have liked Firefox all these years, but this change is just too much. Also, it's not bad enough to put the tabs at the top (where your eye does not easily travel to!), but now the tabs are white type on a black background. Perhaps fine for 25-year-old eyes, but not for older eyes or visually challenged people in general. And if you have multiple tabs open, which many multitaskers do, you can only see a few letters. I could go on and on about how horrible this new change is, but please take some advice from a retired graphic designer. Black backgrounds with faint light type are not the way to go.

Réiteach roghnaithe

Lots of issues!

(1) Tab bar position

You can use a custom style rule in a userChrome.css file to rearrange the toolbars.

(A) You need to create a new chrome folder in your profile folder. This article has the steps for that (#1, #2, and optionally #3)

https://www.userchrome.org/how-create-userchrome-css.html

(B) Download the following file and move it into that chrome folder:

https://www.userchrome.org/samples/userChrome-tabs_on_bottom.css

(C) Rename the file to just userChrome.css

The next time you quit Firefox and start it up again, it should discover that file and apply the rules.

Success?

(2) Changing white-on-black text

Firefox 57 has 3 "themes" built in (default, light, and dark) which you can experiment with on the Customize page using the Themes button at the bottom. Could you check whether any of those work for you.

See: Customize Firefox controls, buttons and toolbars

The menu that pops up from the button also has an option to go to the Mozilla Add-ons site to look at additional themes. Many of these are solid colors, while some are quite wild. If you have a preferred shade, I would check there.

If none of that works, a custom style rule could be applied to adjust either a light or dark theme. You'll need to figure out your preferred colors for the active and inactive tabs.

(3) Tab Width Too Narrow

Before Firefox 57, no tab ever was more narrow than 100 pixels. To fit more tabs, that minimum was reduced to 76. You can increase it again using this setting:

(A) In a new tab, type or paste about:config in the address bar and press Enter/Return. Click the button accepting the risk.

(B) In the search box above the list, type or paste tabmin and pause while the list is filtered

(C) Double-click the browser.tabs.tabMinWidth preference and change 76 to your preferred minimum then click OK.

You also can use a custom style rule to make a little more space by hiding the "X" close buttons until you hover your mouse over the tab. This would be something you add to your userChrome.css file. Here's the rule:

/* Hide tab close buttons until hovered */
.tabbrowser-tab:not([pinned="true"]):not(:hover) .tab-close-button {
  display: none !important;
}

Actually, I think below a certain size Firefox will hide them anyway, but maybe that will help in some cases.

Hopefully with these changes Firefox 57 will be more pleasant to look at and more productive to use.

Read this answer in context 👍 23

All Replies (20)

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I'm not opposed to a workaround to get tabs on the bottom. The Add-ons (not working for Quantum) are basically workarounds. I just can't get this posted workaround to work. The instructions are not difficult to follow but for some reason its not working for me.

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jscher2000 said

Hi RevertSearch, I'm sorry you don't like Firefox 57 or having to create a userChrome.css file, but that's what support volunteers can offer you, and this is the support forum. If you want to raise policy issues or foment an uprising, you can take it to a more appropriate venue. For example: Feedback: https://qsurvey.mozilla.com/s3/FirefoxInput/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Firefox Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/firefox/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/firefox Or maybe a petition site.

Already on it! Plus, It's been hinted to me that Mozilla reads here too. You know, to learn what problems people commonly have. It is a Mozilla site after all, and this is about as offical a support site as it gets.

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mgmm1 said

I'm not opposed to a workaround to get tabs on the bottom. The Add-ons (not working for Quantum) are basically workarounds. I just can't get this posted workaround to work. The instructions are not difficult to follow but for some reason its not working for me.

Can you try Firefox's Browser Toolbox? It's a built-in developer tool that lets you confirm that userChrome.css was loaded and edit it with more or less real-time preview. I think this is the best way to concern that the file is in the correct location with the correct name -- otherwise, it doesn't load.

This article has the steps to call up the Browser Toolbox: https://developer.mozilla.org/docs/Tools/Browser_Toolbox

After you turn on the two checkboxes and call it, you will also get a prompt to allow a remote connection (from your own computer to your own computer). This sometimes hides behind the Toolbox and you need to access it by switching among your Firefox windows.

I have it in one of the videos if you want to watch a boring demo:

https://vimeo.com/242513527#t=346s

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I tried this solution and did not work for me. I'm using Windows.

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Hi MrDisco, could you try the advice in this reply:

https://support.mozilla.org/questions/1185495?page=2#answer-1033168

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Thanks but I just installed the previous version. Quantum was seriously way too aggravating and that was only after 15min of use. Now my big issue is the toolbar display is all messed up (remnants of that awful upgrade). Sigh.

thanks for trying.

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The-edmeister: People are not asking for the ability to customize the UI any way they wished, as has caused problems in the past. They are asking for the same basic default add-on-free interface that they have been accustomed to using for years. Mozilla should have created that as an option by default so as not to cause confusion for their loyal user base. My 75 year old father, for example, is starting to show signs of dementia. He still operates fine within his normal routine, which includes reading the newspaper online, doing the crossword, checking stock prices, listening to NPR online, etc. But anything outside that routine, like a different picture on an icon (library instead of bookmarks) or changing the order of the buttons on the toolbar throws him off. He's never written a line of code in his life, despite being highly intelligent (a mechanical engineer and patent attorney), and its simply unreasonable to expect him to write code in a separate file to make the user interface work as it always has before. Not to mention the time required to find instructions on how to reverse every little unnecessary change that was made (yes, I refuse to believe that the black color or different toolbar locations or icon drawings are significantly impactful on better performance vs. what was) and execute them. It's not whining for users to object to being treated so inconsiderately by Mozilla. There are millions of users who never customized the older versuons of Firefox and don't want to start now. Why should we have to waste hours individually recreating the classic interface they trained us to use over many years (or waste hours learning the new one) when a single Mozilla engineer could fix the problem for everyone with a single option under settings to "Use classic interface"? Some of this stuff isn't really optional either for people with vision challenges, like being able to make menu font big enough to read or not have black backgrounds inducing eyestrain.

Just the fact that people have to find their way to this forum just to find the instructions you think anyone should be able to follow is itself sufficient evidence that Mozilla did not think through how these changes were going to impact their average end-user (i.e., someone who doesn't use themes or edit config files).

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jscher2000 said

mgmm1 said
I'm not opposed to a workaround to get tabs on the bottom. The Add-ons (not working for Quantum) are basically workarounds. I just can't get this posted workaround to work. The instructions are not difficult to follow but for some reason its not working for me.

Can you try Firefox's Browser Toolbox? It's a built-in developer tool that lets you confirm that userChrome.css was loaded and edit it with more or less real-time preview. I think this is the best way to concern that the file is in the correct location with the correct name -- otherwise, it doesn't load.

This article has the steps to call up the Browser Toolbox: https://developer.mozilla.org/docs/Tools/Browser_Toolbox

After you turn on the two checkboxes and call it, you will also get a prompt to allow a remote connection (from your own computer to your own computer). This sometimes hides behind the Toolbox and you need to access it by switching among your Firefox windows.

I have it in one of the videos if you want to watch a boring demo:

https://vimeo.com/242513527#t=346s

@jscher,

Thanks for your patience and help. I finally had success.

I went through your instructions again and this time watched your videos (not boring).  It looks like I first created the chrome folder in the wrong place.  The second thing I did not originally do was to enable the file name extensions.  After doing that, the text file name was showing userChrome.css.txt.  I removed the .txt, re-booted Firefox and now the tabs are on the bottom.

Looks the several user errors on my part. Thanks again.

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Yes, once again the Firefox developers show that they have not yet realised that Firefox is no longer a niche browser used by computer literate enthusiasts but a main stream browser used by the general public who are mainly not computer literate enthusiasts.

More than that, the layout of the screen defies standard logic. How do you search? You go from the general to the particular. So the screen layout should reflect that - i.e. search bar (the general, it's blank so you can enter in whatever you want to search for, you can't get more general than that), then open tabs (becoming more particular now), then the screen of the tab you are looking at.

Add to this lack of logical layout the fact that the tabs are black with white print and, I think, smaller, make the screen still less user friendly. The standard of dark print on a light (usually white) background is used because that is, for the very great majority of the population, the best combination.

And the oft-repeated statement that Firefox developers rarely if ever look at this forum just confirms that they couldn't really care what problems they inflict on Firefox users.

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fedup101 said

And the oft-repeated statement that Firefox developers rarely if ever look at this forum just confirms that they couldn't really care what problems they inflict on Firefox users.

User advocates, not developers, review these forums and a range of other sources of feedback to prioritize changes. But I think your comment on developers is completely off-base. Developers can work anywhere, there is a shortage in the market. They either want to create the best browser possible or they'd be somewhere else. And do you think they can hide from friends and family who use Firefox and tell them their thoughts to their face? I'm sure they get a lot of very frank comments on their work without having to read the thousands of posts here every week. Believe me, reading even part of this is a full time job in itself.

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What a core developer may consider the 'best browser' may not be the most comfortable human interface.

What a cutting-edge UI designer considers the most clean and easy from their perspective may not be what people want to use.

I personally would have left in controls to move the location bar and other functions, as well as allowed a choice to toggle between Photon and a UI schmeme (colors, tabs, fonts, spacing) matching up with older browsers. And then use the feedback info to survey which one gets more use. Hell, I would have had a page upon first install asking which UI scheme to use

If user advocates do read here, and Twitter, and Facebook, they'll see a lot of complaints from people about the new UI's deficiencies.

It's a dealkiller.

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Good points, RevertSearch.

I think that much of the IT industry, including software development, is self-perpetuating, producing equipment with functions which few people want and software which few people use. What the public get is driven by what the computer-IT enthusiasts, rather than what the mass of people who buy the stuff want or use. New models of smartphones and tablets etc., must be produced to keep the profits rolling in, new apps and functions must be created to keep people buying the new IT stuff and to keep the providers of broadband etc., making money. In some ways, personal IT products are increasingly a matter of status (Look, I've got the latest smartphone!). Gold chain round the neck man of the 1970s is now latest IT gizmo in hand man.

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Hi jscher2000, Thanks for the reply about toolbar font size. However, I'm not sure where the following goes. Is it in the css file? Sorry, but I've never had to put code into a program before, so this is all new to me. For moving the tabs below the address bar, there was a download, but there isn't for this and I'm lost.

I did try to add it to the css file but was unable to do so, and I had no idea if that was what to do anyway.

/* Change 12px font-size to 14px on Bookmarks Toolbar */

  1. PersonalToolbar,
  2. PersonalToolbar .bookmark-item,
  3. PersonalToolbar .openintabs-menuitem{
 font-size: 14px !important;

}

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jscher2000 said

jmazzeo said
Now the bookmarks toolbar is such a tiny font that my extremely challenged eyes have difficulty with it. Is there a fix to make the font larger? I'd be so grateful!!

Firefox has a global zoom factor that applies to the user interface as well as to the content. If the only part of the UI that is too small is the text on the bookmarks toolbar, then perhaps a custom style rule would be preferable to a global change.

/* Change 12px font-size to 14px on Bookmarks Toolbar */
#PersonalToolbar, 
#PersonalToolbar .bookmark-item, 
#PersonalToolbar .openintabs-menuitem{
  font-size: 14px !important;
}
Oh, and ONE MORE THING. The old style FF had space running across the entire top of the page that you could grab with your mouse to move the window around. Now it's a teeny, tiny space that is only grabable where there is space in line with the address bar, search bar, etc. By adding flexible space to move the arrows to the right and to put space between the address and search bars I was able to free up 2 spots that I could grab to move the window, but it's extremely annoying to not be able to do it the way I could before. Hope you'll tell me there's a fix for this too!

Well, there is a space at the left end of the tab bar, but that's not up there now. I'm not sure of the best way to make space. I'll try to look into it; maybe if I can do it on Windows the same thing will work on Mac.

So the zoom is global? How do we apply it to the entire UI and only the UI at once? And how do we restore the boomarks dropdown to its old width?

Oh, and if we have to change tab colors ourselves if won't don't want the awful choices (and can't find themes that are good enough for both active and inactive tabs), how are we supposed to code our own? Where's the tutorials on that for 57?

Athraithe ag RevertSearch ar

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I guess n the size of screen developers probably use, i.e. not the general laptop size, the tabs are considerably bigger and so the problem doesn't arise.

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fedup101 said

I guess n the size of screen developers probably use, i.e. not the general laptop size, the tabs are considerably bigger and so the problem doesn't arise.

It would not surprise me in the least if the Quantum devs coded the non-Touchscreen modes for larger screens. Even on Touch mode the fonts are too damn small and thin. And in Dark the menu bar is black words on a dark grey background. It's a joke.

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I realize this isn't the place to discuss it, and that the developers don't frequent this site, and that those that do are here to help us, not justify all the decisions some other department made. But I think what is so frustrating is that it's obvious that a few focus groups would have brought these issues to light, and so there's an implicit assumption that simple market research wasn't done - which is frustrating to all of us.

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jmazzeo said

I'm not sure where the following goes. Is it in the css file?
/* Change 12px font-size to 14px on Bookmarks Toolbar */
#PersonalToolbar, 
#PersonalToolbar .bookmark-item, 
#PersonalToolbar .openintabs-menuitem{
  font-size: 14px !important;
}

Yes, you can open userChrome.css in a text editor, add a couple line breaks at the end and paste the above. Firefox should pick it up at the next restart.

You can use the Browser Toolbox to live-edit the userChrome.css file in case 14px isn't a noticeable difference. I demo that in the second half of this video: https://vimeo.com/242513527#t=345s

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RevertSearch said

So the zoom is global? How do we apply it to the entire UI and only the UI at once? And how do we restore the boomarks dropdown to its old width?

This setting is the global zoom: layout.css.devPixelsPerPx

When you say "the bookmarks dropdown" which one do you mean? Classic menu bar, bookmarks menu button on the toolbar, something else?

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You can use the Browser Toolbox to live-edit the userChrome.css file in case 14px isn't a noticeable difference. I demo that in the second half of this video: https://vimeo.com/242513527#t=345s </blockquote>

Do I have to join vimeo ? I can't get the video to play. Is it also - please say yes - on youtube somewhere?

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